# Frostbite 3 engine needs to be scrapped **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [July 16, 2019, 3:06am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081 "2019-07-16T03:06:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![supawogman](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/s/ed8c4c/32.png) [@supawogman](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/supawogman)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 3:06am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/1 "2019-07-16T03:06:00Z")
Frostbite 3 was introduced to the public in 2013 with Battlefield 4, It’s now 2019/20, 6 years later and the the engine is still buggy with the same problems as it had in BF4, I believe if developers haven’t refined the engine by now its time to scrap it and start over. Graphics mean nothing if the engine is fundamentally broken to its core, DICE needs to take a few years off making games, scrap Frostbite 3 completely and build a new engine with user friendly/developer friendly being a core aspect of the engine for new developers and all game genres not a engine built sorely for Battlefield/first person shooters and veteran game developers that understand the hard to understand Frostbite 3 code. ---
**Author:** ![duttyranksnz](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/d/7cd45c/32.png) [@duttyranksnz](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/duttyranksnz)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 8:33am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/2 "2019-07-16T08:33:00Z")
Funny how they make it work fine on fifa , e.a don’t care otherwise it would be sorted , all the top frostbite devs work on fifa now ---
**Author:** ![duttyranksnz](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/d/7cd45c/32.png) [@duttyranksnz](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/duttyranksnz)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 8:37am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/3 "2019-07-16T08:37:00Z")
I agree tho frostbite looks great but it ruined Anthem , they asked E.A for help but where told no as they didn’t want to take anyone away from the Fifa frostbite team ,it’s about money but yes it’s abitch of an engine to adapt or add features to ---
**Author:** ![bunningsSnagz](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/e5b9ba/32.png) [@bunningsSnagz](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/bunningsSnagz)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 8:42am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/4 "2019-07-16T08:42:00Z")
> [@duttyranksnz](#): > > Funny how they make it work fine on fifa , e.a don’t care otherwise it would be sorted , all the top frostbite devs work on fifa now FIFA is a copy and paste game, it would be hard to mess that up. ---
**Author:** ![e-Sparta\_Rambo](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/e-sparta_rambo/32/101814_2.png) [@e-Sparta\_Rambo](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/e-Sparta_Rambo)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 9:27am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/5 "2019-07-16T09:27:00Z")
> [@bunningsSnagz](#): > > duttyranksnz said: > Funny how they make it work fine on fifa , e.a don’t care otherwise it would be sorted , all the top frostbite devs work on fifa now > > FIFA is a copy and paste game, it would be hard to mess that up. But so is Battlefield if you apply same logic, remodel/reskin soldiers, weapons and maps there you go, new game… ---
**Author:** ![ProAssassin2003](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/proassassin2003/32/103170_2.png) [@ProAssassin2003](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/ProAssassin2003)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 9:36am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/6 "2019-07-16T09:36:00Z")
Frostbite is a beautiful Engine at times but the Code and what runs it is so broken and outdated developers struggle to get it to work at all. It’s been proven and talked about for ages. Frostbite is a Nightmare to work with. So yes Frostbite needs scrapped or rebuilt. If next Battlefield uses Frostbite it will be the same as BFV. Nothing will change. ---
**Author:** ![sabootheshaman](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/sabootheshaman/32/103347_2.png) [@sabootheshaman](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/sabootheshaman)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 9:48am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/7 "2019-07-16T09:48:00Z")
Everything on this thread is speculation. Armchair experts on a far more complex thing. Have a look at WW3, tell me it gets anywhere near BFV. I’ve sunk a lot of hours into WW3 and I can say it’s a long way from achieving anything close to a core BF experience. ---
**Author:** ![MogwaiWarrior](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/mogwaiwarrior/32/102838_2.png) [@MogwaiWarrior](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/MogwaiWarrior)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 12:14pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/8 "2019-07-16T12:14:00Z")
Don’t blame the engine, blame the people who are programming it. BF1 looks great and for the most part ran great throughout it’s entire life cycle. This shows us if you know how to program the Frostbite engine it runs fine. DICE have lost all the talent that knew how to program the Frostbite engine. This is why we have the mess that is BFV. Also what other engine could handle the large scale battles that BF brings us? ---
**Author:** ![sabootheshaman](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/sabootheshaman/32/103347_2.png) [@sabootheshaman](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/sabootheshaman)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 1:25pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/9 "2019-07-16T13:25:00Z")
> [@MogwaiWarrior](#): > > Don’t blame the engine, blame the people who are programming it. BF1 looks great and for the most part ran great throughout it’s entire life cycle. This shows us if you know how to program the Frostbite engine it runs fine. DICE have lost all the talent that knew how to program the Frostbite engine. This is why we have the mess that is BFV. Also what other engine could handle the large scale battles that BF brings us? Amen. Ps. Mogwai are the ducks nuts. 🤙 ---
**Author:** ![Ferdinand\_J\_Foch](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/ferdinand_j_foch/32/101936_2.png) [@Ferdinand\_J\_Foch](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/Ferdinand_J_Foch)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 1:26pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/10 "2019-07-16T13:26:00Z")
> [@MogwaiWarrior](#): > > Don’t blame the engine, blame the people who are programming it. BF1 looks great and for the most part ran great throughout it’s entire life cycle. This shows us if you know how to program the Frostbite engine it runs fine. DICE have lost all the talent that knew how to program the Frostbite engine. This is why we have the mess that is BFV. Also what other engine could handle the large scale battles that BF brings us? I’m a big fan of BF1, to the point that I think it was significantly better than BF4, but even I cannot deny that BF1 had several hiccups of it’s own with it’s patches. There was a serious bug where you would get stuck on a blank screen if you paused your menu during an Operations match … this glitch, as far as I know, was never fixed. There was also a vaulting glitch where you would randomly go prone instead of climbing a wall … this particular glitch is still a pet peeve of mine. BF1 also got game-breaking patches as we started getting the Russian DLC, and the funny part is that it was DICE LA, the saviours of BF4, that were constantly breaking things in BF1. There was the glitch where you couldn’t see friendly player icons. There was a glitch where shots against tanks would ricochet, except for weapons that couldn’t ricochet in the first place. There was the glitch where the game would stutter every time you got points … which is the same thing that is plaguing BFV right now. BF1 also faced serious performance issues about 6 months after release. It took months for things to go back to normal … I think it was Denuvo that caused those performance issues, so I wonder if lightning has struck twice here … DICE LA showed that they too can muck things up, as they demonstrated in BF1. Both DICE studios now have a history of breaking things constantly … they struggled with BF3, BF4, BFH and BF1. Yes, it certainly felt like they had a better grasp back then compared to now, but unfortunately, the current state of BFV is backed up by the history of this franchise with Frostbite 3. We’re seeing the same sort of thing over and over again … a game that DICE struggles with, before it is eventually stable and filled with content. They can’t keep getting away with this … can they? I’ve also seen that quite a few old developers in DICE are still around. People lambasted Niklas Aastrand a while ago for his JU-52 remarks, but this guy has been around since BF 1942. The person who is in charge of vehicle gameplay in BFV has also been around since BF 1942. The map designers on this game have worked on several maps in past games … the person who made Rotterdam made Operation Metro (\* and thus must be fired immediately … s/ … sort of\* ) and Seine Crossing. Lars Gustavsson, aka Mr. Battlefield, is the Creative Director for BFV, and he is one of the longest serving devs in the franchise. So many of this game’s senior developers have been here for many, many years, to the point that I struggle to imagine how they could have let BFV come to this, until I remember that several Battlefield games have been brought to their knees during these devs’ tenures. This studio is, at the same time, one of the most talented **and** incompetent game dev studios ever. They do so many things well, and they do so many things terribly. Even Bethesda will struggle against the mass of contradictions that is DICE. ---
**Author:** ![RABID\_4TUNA](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@RABID\_4TUNA](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/RABID_4TUNA)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 9:44pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/11 "2019-07-16T21:44:00Z")
> [@MogwaiWarrior](#): > > Don’t blame the engine, blame the people who are programming it. BF1 looks great and for the most part ran great throughout it’s entire life cycle. This shows us if you know how to program the Frostbite engine it runs fine. DICE have lost all the talent that knew how to program the Frostbite engine. This is why we have the mess that is BFV. Also what other engine could handle the large scale battles that BF brings us? Even with the best engines (Unreal), people can manage to cook up abominations. Before you ask, lemme show you some bad games made with Unreal ![image](https://battlefieldforum.co/uploads/default/original/3X/4/2/42a84cfa593aa33ce85e6ee85c8ea0b0afb0df6b.jpeg) ![image](https://battlefieldforum.co/uploads/default/original/3X/d/f/df3ee907486009f14cb0159fcd43c5f35c6ba22f.jpeg) ![image](https://battlefieldforum.co/uploads/default/original/3X/a/f/af59fceb566bc548d3def92b14914f927945da79.jpeg) ![image](https://battlefieldforum.co/uploads/default/original/3X/1/8/18837a5544af769154b4ff7d36a1391131cd94e2.png) ![image](https://battlefieldforum.co/uploads/default/original/3X/9/c/9c64bc99e5a3bce7893e4204b3d48ce8fd0a3d3c.png) ![image](https://battlefieldforum.co/uploads/default/original/3X/a/6/a6cfaa5468018363961b54dc29802b158202917f.png) ![image](https://battlefieldforum.co/uploads/default/original/3X/b/6/b67d1e4ddef630bdee1d8eb40ae03eae7f5d29b8.jpeg) ![image](https://battlefieldforum.co/uploads/default/original/3X/0/c/0cfd3f2a0c1927b7d37bbf5708b314f50133baad.png) ---
**Author:** ![BaronVonGoon](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/baronvongoon/32/100934_2.png) [@BaronVonGoon](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/BaronVonGoon)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 10:03pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/12 "2019-07-16T22:03:00Z")
> [@sabootheshaman](#): > > Everything on this thread is speculation. > > . It’s not speculation. BioWare said that Frostbite is a bad engine and using it is like hand kneeding dough filled with razor blades, or something to that effect. Also, Jackfrags posted a video earlier this year (I don’t have time to find it) where he quoted Dice devs themselves describing Frostbite 3 as a ‘liability’. If that’s not enough, just start up BFV and scan around for a few minutes, do you see what I see? Bugs as far as the eyes can see. ---
**Author:** ![spartanx169x](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/s/dfb087/32.png) [@spartanx169x](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/spartanx169x)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 10:07pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/13 "2019-07-16T22:07:00Z")
I know it won’t happen, but I would like to see Respawn do a post apocalyptic Battlefield using the Source engine. ---
**Author:** ![RABID\_4TUNA](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@RABID\_4TUNA](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/RABID_4TUNA)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 10:16pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/14 "2019-07-16T22:16:00Z")
> [@spartanx169x](#): > > I know it won’t happen, but I would like to see Respawn do a post apocalyptic Battlefield using the Source engine. Well, Respawn is making a singleplayer Star Wars game. With Unreal Engine 4. ---
**Author:** ![sabootheshaman](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/sabootheshaman/32/103347_2.png) [@sabootheshaman](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/sabootheshaman)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 10:46pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/15 "2019-07-16T22:46:00Z")
> [@BaronVonGoon](#): > > > [@sabootheshaman](#): > > > > Everything on this thread is speculation. > > > > . > > It’s not speculation. BioWare said that Frostbite is a bad engine and using it is like hand kneeding dough filled with razor blades, or something to that effect. > > Also, Jackfrags posted a video earlier this year (I don’t have time to find it) where he quoted Dice devs themselves describing Frostbite 3 as a ‘liability’. > > If that’s not enough, just start up BFV and scan around for a few minutes, do you see what I see? Bugs as far as the eyes can see. I’ve seen that frags video. I do not recall that quote. I recall it being said BFV had fundamental problems in its development. \*happy to be proven wrong. BioWares experience is not relevant. They also highlighted that it was their own skill set that was the problem. They are not DICE and they were putting a square peg in a round hole. I think conflating different studios problems is not a good idea. The comments on this thread are specific to DICE and BF. DICE built frostbite abd yes I think BFV is a mess but I do think these threads and comments are ill informed. I also can’t see a time in the near future where a similar engine can achieve what frostbite dies for the core BF mechanics. Switching engines fir a studio is also not easy. Having built teams around different technologies multiple times in the past I can say it would be a huge upheaval. ---
**Author:** ![Rev0verDrive](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/r/7993a0/32.png) [@Rev0verDrive](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/Rev0verDrive)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 11:22pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/16 "2019-07-16T23:22:00Z")
> [@MogwaiWarrior](#): > > what other engine could handle the large scale battles that BF brings us? [Unreal Engine 4.22.3](https://www.unrealengine.com/en-US/features) could do it … easily. ---
**Author:** ![sabootheshaman](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/sabootheshaman/32/103347_2.png) [@sabootheshaman](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/sabootheshaman)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 11:31pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/17 "2019-07-16T23:31:00Z")
> [@Rev0verDrive](#): > > MogwaiWarrior said: > what other engine could handle the large scale battles that BF brings us? > > Unreal Engine 4.22.3 could do it … easily. What are you basing that on? Have you seen how well UE handles destruction and deformation? ---
**Author:** ![CSO7777](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@CSO7777](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/CSO7777)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 11:42pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/18 "2019-07-16T23:42:00Z")
It’s apparent something is not good with Frostbite. Just the assignment problem in BFV (stutters) shows that somethings are not as they are supposed to be. And Jackfrags had a video (at the launch of Firestorm I think), where he and other “game-changers” where at Dice Stockholm and he said that a lot of the issues in BFV has to do with Frostbite. A lot of things we would think are easy to fix are actually pretty complicated in real life. I seems like they really need a version 4.0 at this point in time, but making fundamental changes to a ‘beast’ like Frostbite is not easy. Especially now, when EA has a lot of big titles running on Frostbite. Still, Frostbite can produce amazing looking games, BF1 and SWBF2 had groundbreaking graphics when they came out (for multiplayer-games at least) and the performance was pretty good (if you had the HW required). It really seems like BFV, took things too far and the engine just can’t handle it anymore. ---
**Author:** ![ProAssassin2003](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/proassassin2003/32/103170_2.png) [@ProAssassin2003](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/ProAssassin2003)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2019, 11:55pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/19 "2019-07-16T23:55:00Z")
All one has to do is look at the development stories of Mass Effect Andromeda and Anthem to know Frostbite Engine is awful. ---
**Author:** ![sabootheshaman](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/sabootheshaman/32/103347_2.png) [@sabootheshaman](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/sabootheshaman)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2019, 12:02am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081/20 "2019-07-17T00:02:00Z")
> [@ProAssassin2003](#): > > All one has to do is look at the development stories of Mass Effect Andromeda and Anthem to know Frostbite Engine is awful. Yes because conflating issues across studios building games in different genres is the way to solve the problem. [Next page](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/frostbite-3-engine-needs-to-be-scrapped/107081.md?page=2)