# Is this game bent towards casual? **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [April 15, 2019, 11:22pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853 "2019-04-15T23:22:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![von\_Campenstein](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/von_campenstein/32/101003_2.png) [@von\_Campenstein](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/von_Campenstein)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2019, 11:10pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853/81 "2019-04-25T23:10:00Z")
> [@MBT\_Layzan](#): > > I think it is, and are we happy about that? You should be, just got on BF4 and the so called pros there made for very poor gameplay, spawnsniping, everyone with maxed out weapons spassing about spamfiring in the direction their map told them to with the starter weapons being next to useless. It would seem BF1 was the shining exception, well then TTK2.0 happened… ---
**Author:** ![One\_Called\_Kane](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/one_called_kane/32/107031_2.png) [@One\_Called\_Kane](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/One_Called_Kane)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2019, 11:14pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853/82 "2019-04-25T23:14:00Z")
Unless you’re getting paid to play the game you’re a casual player, it doesn’t matter if you’re a weekend warrior with mediocre stats or a human aimbot with top-1% stats. You can argue backwards and forwards over the little nuances of this video game where you shoot pixels vs that video game where you shoot pixels but at the end of the day they are all casual titles meant to be accessible by a large enough percentage of random players to turn a profit. Therefore when you say ‘casual’ I assume what you really meant was ‘easy’. On the one hand your bullets go precisely where they are aimed, they travel quickly, and the guns are generally very lethal, so killing an enemy is much easier. On the other hand, the same is true for your enemy as well. This means on average the better player will win in a random gunfight more frequently than would be the case in titles where random factors like suppression and bullet spread were present. The quick TTK also means positioning is more important, and that the ‘Run and Gun’ playstyle that this community is in such a love-hate relationship with is no longer the end-all strategy and that flanking and tactical positioning (something that has been made more viable in this game than any title since BF2) are suddenly far more important. Does that make this game easier than older titles like BF3/4 or BC2? I don’t think so personally. Battlefield players in particular seem to suffer heavily from rose-tint where older titles are concerned while forgetting that those older games were not without their own cheese. ---
**Author:** ![MBT\_Layzan](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/mbt_layzan/32/102770_2.png) [@MBT\_Layzan](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/MBT_Layzan)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2019, 11:43pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853/83 "2019-04-25T23:43:00Z")
> [@von\_Campenstein](#): > > > [@MBT\_Layzan](#): > > > > I think it is, and are we happy about that? > > You should be, just got on BF4 and the so called pros there made for very poor gameplay, spawnsniping, everyone with maxed out weapons spassing about spamfiring in the direction their map told them to with the starter weapons being next to useless. It would seem BF1 was the shining exception, well then TTK2.0 happened… I miss BF 1943, and games like Vietnam. Or 2142. ---
**Author:** ![spartanx169x](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/s/dfb087/32.png) [@spartanx169x](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/spartanx169x)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2019, 1:28pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853/84 "2019-04-26T13:28:00Z")
> [@Skitelz7](#): > > > [@TennouHeikaBanza](#): > > > > > [@Skitelz7](#): > > > > > > > [@TennouHeikaBanza](#): > > > > > > > > > [@Skitelz7](#): > > > > > > > > > > > [@YourLocalPlumber](#): > > > > > > > > > > > > Can someone in this thread actually tell me what makes it 'casual"? > > > > > > > > > > -spotting flares > > > > > -spotting scopes > > > > > -suppression spoting > > > > > -vehicle gadget/specialization spotting > > > > > -third person camera on vehicles > > > > > -vehicle self repair > > > > > -death cam showing your killer’s location > > > > > -vehicle spawn mechanic > > > > > And the list goes on. > > > > > > > > I guess those hardcore players should rather go play ArmA 3 or Escape from Tarkov. > > > > > > > > Listening to those game changers and placing BF somewhere between normal and hardcore was a huge failure in game design. > > > > > > > > Those who call for hardcore experience wants something completely different from BF franchise. better find another game. > > > > > > Not really. Battlefield started to become “casualized” with the first Bad Company game, and even more so with BF3/4/H. > > > We just want it to go back to its roots. > > > > some of those lists were already in BF2, if I remember correctly. > > > > I think the game that fits most of the conditions is Red Orchestra 2. > > No vehicle 3rd person cam, no self repair, no kill cam, etc. > > > > Well, of course, that kind of hardcore games have very small player base, since most of the gamers just hate those unnecessarily complex mechanics. And EA and DICE won’t wanna sell BF that few. > > I would be fine with everything else in BFV if they just removed all types of spotting. > Its such a ridiculous mechanic. So me being able to tell my teammates that multiple enemies that are about to ambush them is a ridiculous mechanic? Because that is all spotting is. Its a simple way to communicate to teammates that is all it is. People don’t use mics, Even if they do, you can only communicate with your squad. Then there is all the nonsense that goes on with people that do have mics. So in saying its a ridiculous mechanic you have no issue watching your teammates 100 meters away get utterly slaughtered because you could not let them know where 1 or 2 enemies were at? ---
**Author:** ![Hawxxeye](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/hawxxeye/32/101036_2.png) [@Hawxxeye](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/Hawxxeye)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2019, 3:32pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853/85 "2019-04-26T15:32:00Z")
the game is not bent towards casual it is bent towards Assault and any other class that has mid to long range fast firing weapons ---
**Author:** ![Skitelz7](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/skitelz7/32/103511_2.png) [@Skitelz7](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/Skitelz7)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2019, 4:19pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853/86 "2019-04-26T16:19:00Z")
> [@spartanx169x](#): > > Skitelz7 said: > > TennouHeikaBanza wrote: » > > Skitelz7 wrote: » > > TennouHeikaBanza wrote: » > > Skitelz7 wrote: » > > YourLocalPlumber wrote: » > Can someone in this thread actually tell me what makes it 'casual"? > > -spotting flares > > -spotting scopes > > -suppression spoting > > -vehicle gadget/specialization spotting > > -third person camera on vehicles > > -vehicle self repair > > -death cam showing your killer’s location > > -vehicle spawn mechanic > > And the list goes on. > > I guess those hardcore players should rather go play ArmA 3 or Escape from Tarkov. > > Listening to those game changers and placing BF somewhere between normal and hardcore was a huge failure in game design. > > Those who call for hardcore experience wants something completely different from BF franchise. better find another game. > > Not really. Battlefield started to become “casualized” with the first Bad Company game, and even more so with BF3/4/H. > > We just want it to go back to its roots. > > some of those lists were already in BF2, if I remember correctly. > > I think the game that fits most of the conditions is Red Orchestra 2. > > No vehicle 3rd person cam, no self repair, no kill cam, etc. > > Well, of course, that kind of hardcore games have very small player base, since most of the gamers just hate those unnecessarily complex mechanics. And EA and DICE won’t wanna sell BF that few. > > I would be fine with everything else in BFV if they just removed all types of spotting. > > Its such a ridiculous mechanic. > > So me being able to tell my teammates that multiple enemies that are about to ambush them is a ridiculous mechanic? Because that is all spotting is. Its a simple way to communicate to teammates that is all it is. People don’t use mics, Even if they do, you can only communicate with your squad. Then there is all the nonsense that goes on with people that do have mics. So in saying its a ridiculous mechanic you have no issue watching your teammates 100 meters away get utterly slaughtered because you could not let them know where 1 or 2 enemies were at? You can do that with the current marking mechanic. I have no problem with that. What I don’t like is the the other type of spotting (minimap and 3D) that marks the enemie’s exact position and follows them around. That type of spotting is made specifically to help noobs and casual players while punishing players that have done nothing wrong. That type of spotting has to go. ---
**Author:** ![Skitelz7](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/skitelz7/32/103511_2.png) [@Skitelz7](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/Skitelz7)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2019, 4:21pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853/87 "2019-04-26T16:21:00Z")
> [@Hawxxeye](#): > > the game is not bent towards casual it is bent towards Assault and any other class that has mid to long range fast firing weapons Maybe on PC where all you have to do is point and click. On consoles it seems more balanced since it takes more skill to aim and control the recoil. ---
**Author:** ![Hawxxeye](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/hawxxeye/32/101036_2.png) [@Hawxxeye](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/Hawxxeye)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2019, 4:36pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853/88 "2019-04-26T16:36:00Z")
> [@Skitelz7](#): > > > [@Hawxxeye](#): > > > > the game is not bent towards casual it is bent towards Assault and any other class that has mid to long range fast firing weapons > > Maybe on PC where all you have to do is point and click. > On consoles it seems more balanced since it takes more skill to aim and control the recoil. I still do not get why cant the consoles get their own separate balance and patch cycle. It would be a win-win situation cause some guns could be adjusted with just consoles in mind and they would able to patch the PC version more often and thus try changes without committing to an entire month before fixing the problems that are introduced in the patch ---
**Author:** ![MBT\_Layzan](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/mbt_layzan/32/102770_2.png) [@MBT\_Layzan](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/MBT_Layzan)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2019, 6:38pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853/89 "2019-04-26T18:38:00Z")
> [@Hawxxeye](#): > > > [@Skitelz7](#): > > > > > [@Hawxxeye](#): > > > > > > the game is not bent towards casual it is bent towards Assault and any other class that has mid to long range fast firing weapons > > > > Maybe on PC where all you have to do is point and click. > > On consoles it seems more balanced since it takes more skill to aim and control the recoil. > > I still do not get why cant the consoles get their own separate balance and patch cycle. > It would be a win-win situation cause some guns could be adjusted with just consoles in mind and they would able to patch the PC version more often and thus try changes without committing to an entire month before fixing the problems that are introduced in the patch I hate it, they make tanks aiming all wired and slow, mess with turret speed, but we on PC have to face laser accuracy AT assault weapon spam. ---
**Author:** ![sabootheshaman](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/sabootheshaman/32/103347_2.png) [@sabootheshaman](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/sabootheshaman)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2019, 1:30am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853/90 "2019-04-29T01:30:00Z")
> [@Skitelz7](#): > > > [@sabootheshaman](#): > > > > > [@Skitelz7](#): > > > > > > > [@MachoFantast1c0](#): > > > > > > > > Skitelz7 said: > > > > > > > > Vycinas2 wrote: » > > > > > > > > Skitelz7 wrote: » > > > > > > > > Vycinas2 wrote: » > > > > > > > > Skitelz7 wrote: » > > > > > > > > Noodlesocks wrote: » > > > > Game is such a mish mash of design concepts that I’m not even sure if Dice Sweden knows the answer. > > > > > > > > This. > > > > > > > > They remove spotting and add attrition but then add spotting flares and spotting scopes. > > > > > > > > I think DICE is completely lost more than anything. > > > > > > > > Not really. Spotting flares and scope can make useless scout somewhat useful. I get it you re an easy core (my apologies hardcore) lover. I cant remember when was the last time I looked at mini map to benefit from someone being spotted (perhaps BC2, maybe BF3), because I purely rely on audio on my headset. Does it make a difference if you re spotted ? Yes if you are bad at 1v1, not if you can win your gunfights. > > > > > > > > Dice is lost what they want this game to be, attrition, spotting has nothing to do with it. > > > > > > > > Spotting has everything to do with it. > > > > > > > > What good is it if I’m better than the other guy when he can shoot up a spotting flare, see my position and come up behind me for a kill without me ever knowing he was there? > > > > > > > > Good luck hearing footsteps with all the gunshots and explosion around. > > > > > > > > I think they should have removed EVERY kind of spotting. Minimap and 3D. > > > > > > > > Spotting is there to help casual players do better. Period. > > > > > > > > Oh dear lord… if you allow someone to shoot a flare and come behind you then I suggest you do some exercise. I am a casual because I have very little time for gaming but even so I could easily destroy you if they introduced easy core mode. And I am not attacking you or stat bashing just telling you, you are a part of that casual crowd. I am and many others are better than you regardless of what mechanics game has to offer, just like you are better than me in.. hmmm being stationary ? However if you wish to stop blaming the game mechanics for your deaths I suggest you follow 3 simple steps: > > > > > > > > 1. Learn > > > > > > > > 2. Adapt > > > > > > > > 3. Overcome > > > > > > > > If I allow someone to shoot a flare? Am I supposed to predict he’s going to shoot one, go up to him and ask him not to do it? > > > > > > > > Don’t kid yourself. > > > > > > > > It sounds as if you are not aware that they are trivial to shoot down. To the point of being generally not all that useful against competent opponents. > > > > > > By the time you spot it and shoot it down it has already marked you and you whole squad. Your point is completely dull. > > > Try again. > > > > You know it’s ok to admit someone’s point is reasonable instead of exaggerating and being hyperbolic. > > > > Flare guns make a noise on shot and when they are drifting down. They also have a delay till they spot after the parachute is deployed. Shoot it then move. Leave a Bouncong Betty for extra saltiness. > > Yeah, a delay of what? 1 second? > From the time you shoot it up to the time it spots enemies is less than three seconds and that’s all it takes for some dumb noob to look at the map and magically know my position. > Players should only get punished when they do somethibg wrong. > The flare spotting players that did nothing wrong is completely stupid and made for the sole purpuse of helping those that suck at the expense of punishing those that don’t. > If you think that’s good game design, I feel very sorry for you. Sorry you are an expert on Game design? Why feel sorry for me? Im not the one having a cry about a mechanic that has been in the game since BF2. The delay is significant and I know the guys that I play with regularly call it out when they hear one go up and will drop it if need be. To be honest, one of the positives of BFV is that everything can be countered. I feel sorry for you for your lack of willingness to adjust your play style. ---
**Author:** ![r3cklesshate23ps](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/r/8dc957/32.png) [@r3cklesshate23ps](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/r3cklesshate23ps)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2019, 3:29am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853/91 "2019-05-07T03:29:00Z")
> [@Vycinas2](#): > > > [@UnearthedCO](#): > > > > LOLGotYerTags said: > > Battlefield has always been catered to the “casual” gamer. > > > > There isn’t much in terms of competitive gameplay in the BF series, 3 seems decent enough to lean into the competitive area. > > > > BF1 had that incursions but I don’t think there are servers for it anymore. > > > > COD caters to the casual gamer not BF. > > So does BF. You can make it competitive with leagues and certain rules but the whole core is built for casuals. End of story. The rules in these “leagues” destroy the game. The restrictions applied to esb and bmf and other “leagues”(a joke in their entirety) ruin the Competitiveness for every player. They do not stablize the game, and do not create an enviroment where players are more on par. Its a joke. And Competitive battlefield will never work with such rules a restrictions. In 7 months we’ll have new nations, weapons, and vehicles. 75% or more of which has already been restricted by these “leagues” and they arent even out yet. They havent been nerfed. They havent been tried and tested. But gaurunteed banned. Tis a joke [Previous page](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/is-this-game-bent-towards-casual/106853.md?page=4)