# It's time to NERF Planes!!! **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [March 26, 2017, 9:26pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102 "2017-03-26T21:26:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![ColonelCuckold](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/c/9e8a1a/32.png) [@ColonelCuckold](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/ColonelCuckold)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2017, 11:33pm UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/41 "2017-04-08T23:33:00Z")
> [@SaintBrandon88](#): > > I get killed by tanks more than planes. This is the truth, and the fact is, heavy tanks alone accumulate more kills than all planes combined, and by a pretty decent margin. That said, the recent AA nerf was not needed. I don’t even really feel like the fighter is OP. I just think they nerfed the tail-gun of the attack plane too much. I used to fly the attack planes mainly, but it’s hard to keep them in the air. Basically, it’s just imbalanced. I can agree that infantry weapons should do a bit more damage to planes, especially when hitting in the right locations of the planes. Then you need to get better gunners because an attack plane tail gunner shreds both bomber killers and dog fighters in half the time it takes for either of those planes to even score a disable…and air to air rockets are next to useless because most of the time they just fly between the wings ---
**Author:** ![Trokey66](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/trokey66/32/103889_2.png) [@Trokey66](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/Trokey66)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 12:47am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/42 "2017-04-09T00:47:00Z")
> [@lllTheSentinelll](#): > > > [@Trokey66](#): > > > > > [@lllTheSentinelll](#): > > > > > > > [@Trokey66](#): > > > > > > > > > [@SaintBrandon88](#): > > > > > > > > > > Flying isn’t easy when you’ve got a better pilot on the other team. > > > > > > > > Bit of a pointless statement and a poor argument for saying flying isn’t easy. > > > > > > > > No matter how bad or good you are at any given activity, you will always come across some one who is better. > > > > > > > > > [@lllTheSentinelll](#): > > > > > > > > > > The simple fact remains that at any given time, there can be up to 4 to 6 planes available out of 64 players on a server. A far fewer percentage of players are able to do very well with planes. That means that planes are harder to use than most of the things in the game, and so we should be nerfing a several other things before we nerf planes. Simple math and inequalities…but DICE (or casualfielders) doesn’t do logic. > > > > > > > > Again, the number of planes available per player and therefore the limit on the numbers of players able to fly does not mean it is hard unless you count smashing X to spawn in a vehicle a ‘skill’. > > > > > > > > Fact is the better player in the air at a given time, no matter what his ability is, can farm infantry far to easily. > > > > > > > > Indeed, the ability to dogfight becomes irrelevant in games where air truces, either formal or informal, are in play. > > > > > > > > Fact is, the Trench Fighter is: > > > > > > > > 1. Easy to use. > > > > 2. Effective in most circumstances > > > > 3. Difficult to counter for the majority regardless of their ability.. > > > > > > > > That is almost the text book definition of OP were such a definition to exist. > > > > > > Of course it’s not hard to get into a plane. I said that there ARE plenty of people using planes (4 to 6 in any given game of 64), which is around 9 percent of players. I’m saying that a far lower percentage of players are very good with planes. Which means that in general, a low percentage of people trying their hand at flying are good with them. Compare this with just about any other tool in the game where people have a much higher success rate. That means that planes are harder to use than most tools in the game. Which means that it makes no sense at all to even think about nerfing them until you also nerf everything that is easier (statistically speaking, and just looking at how many people are succeeding with them compared to how many are using them) and more effective than them, which is ALMOST EVERYTHING IN THE GAME. > > > > > > Good god..I really need to stop using mathematics on this forum I forget who I’m dealing with. > > > > Not seeing any mathematics in this post that prices farming infantry is hard. > > > > Yes there are other things in this game that are ‘easy’ but generally speaking, their counters are effective. > > > > There are exceptions such as the Heavy Tank but this thread is not talking about Heavy Tanks, it is about Air but specifically, the Trench Fighter. > > > > As it stands, the only real and effective counter to a Trench Fighter is another fighter and that should NOT be the case. > > > > Is it right that a ‘better player’ in general terms, can get farmed by a statistically ‘worse player’ simply because of the vehicle he is in? The better player will try but invariably, the enemy team will thwart his attempts or he’ll get darted trying. > > > > And @SaintBrandon88 the fact that a ‘better player’ in a things only effective counter should always prevail is a very poor argument to not want changes. > > > > Off the top of my head, I can’t think of a single thing in this game that dies not have more than one freely available, effective counter. And by that, I mean equipment an infantry player can load out or Stationary Emplacements around the Battlefield. I have purposely not included other Fighters or the MAA because they are usually not freely available. > > > > I am dog egg at flying but in my limited experience in a Trench Fighter, the ground is NOT a threat unless I crash into it (my second biggest killer!) > > If it were so easy, you would have 5-6 people in planes every game at the top of the scoreboard getting 10-20 KDR’s. Do you have that? No. You have maybe one such person in any given conquest game out of the 6 people trying to use planes (ineffectively…because they’re harder than most things in the game). So if a low proportion of people trying their hand at it are succeeding, what does that tell you? How the hell can it be OP if most people can’t even use it effectively? And there is a very simple counter: the AA. Sure, a TF can kill an AA user. But how often does that happen compared with an AA user killing a TF user? lol > > You just said that you have limited experience in planes, and that your second biggest killer is flying into the ground. So how the hell are you going to talk about how “easy” or “hard” a plane is compared with other tools offered in the game and whether or not planes need to be nerfed? What basis do you have? Your experience as an infantry player? > > #logic > #busting your belief system, one myth at a time I started flying the TF with the release of TSNP. I have 1000% more kills in the TF than I achieved in BF4. I have darted more people of AA than have shot me down. I have achieved very healthy 5-10 KD rounds in a TF. I have even managed to shoot numerous Aircraft down. I am complete dog egg at flying and have limited experience, I should NOT be able to do this. Simple fact of the matter is, TFs are far to easy and shouldn’t really be in the game. Next feeble excuse from you? ---
**Author:** ![Vic\_R0cks](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/vic_r0cks/32/101844_2.png) [@Vic\_R0cks](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/Vic_R0cks)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 1:09am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/43 "2017-04-09T01:09:00Z")
Attack plane users: how do you not run into fighter planes all the times? Fighters need a nerf against infantry, it’s purpose should be fighting other planes. Then maybe it gets less attractive when it’s not the jack of all trades anymore. ---
**Author:** ![KorpusDraige](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/korpusdraige/32/102566_2.png) [@KorpusDraige](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/KorpusDraige)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 1:13am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/44 "2017-04-09T01:13:00Z")
> [@Vic\_R0cks](#): > > Attack plane users: how do you not run into fighter planes all the times? Fighters need a nerf against infantry, it’s purpose should be fighting other planes. Then maybe it gets less attractive when it’s not the jack of all trades anymore. I do, but the Fighters die 😉 ---
**Author:** ![PrecisionWing](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/precisionwing/32/103161_2.png) [@PrecisionWing](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/PrecisionWing)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 1:38am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/45 "2017-04-09T01:38:00Z")
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**Author:** ![rommelafric1](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@rommelafric1](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/rommelafric1)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 5:44am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/46 "2017-04-09T05:44:00Z")
Way to go you f_ **ing b** _hes complained about omg the AA is to strong boo who aww can’t fly aww, now look what happened… ---
**Author:** ![SirBobdk](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/sirbobdk/32/103491_2.png) [@SirBobdk](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/SirBobdk)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 6:59am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/47 "2017-04-09T06:59:00Z")
Could therer be a difference whether you play on console or PC, or not CQ I play on PC and CQ and have played a lot of infantry lately. Overall i spend 40% of time as infantry. I don’t see any pilots getting high killstreak, most of them do less than 0,4 KPM and die a lot. Frankly, I die more from snipers and tanks than from planes. I agree on the issue with the trench fighter and it should be changed The good pilots can easily go 40-1, but i don’t see it happen so often. After 1700 maps i have seen 5-10 other pilots doing 40-1. I realy don’t see the problem on PC and CQ. Just me??? ---
**Author:** ![gtac10](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/gtac10/32/102138_2.png) [@gtac10](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/gtac10)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 7:10am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/48 "2017-04-09T07:10:00Z")
Pc pilots seem to be better than console pilots, even though the plane stats are the same, just look at Niccaman ---
**Author:** ![gtac10](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/gtac10/32/102138_2.png) [@gtac10](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/gtac10)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 7:16am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/49 "2017-04-09T07:16:00Z")
For anyone that says the trench fighter plane isn’t op, here is a clip of me with it on xbox 1: [http://xboxclips.com/zdoxx8016/37a8a0bf-2768-49c2-8bc1-a0a7b83e43c9](http://xboxclips.com/zdoxx8016/37a8a0bf-2768-49c2-8bc1-a0a7b83e43c9) Note: I made the video, therefore I own it, using it for financial benefit will result in a copyright claim ---
**Author:** ![SirBobdk](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/sirbobdk/32/103491_2.png) [@SirBobdk](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/SirBobdk)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 7:25am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/50 "2017-04-09T07:25:00Z")
> [@gtac10](#): > > Pc pilots seem to be better than console pilots, even though the plane stats are the same, just look at Niccaman I just say i don’t see it happen so often in CQ. And half the maps are not even plane maps, but more infantry and tank maps. ---
**Author:** ![SirBobdk](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/sirbobdk/32/103491_2.png) [@SirBobdk](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/SirBobdk)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 7:28am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/51 "2017-04-09T07:28:00Z")
> [@gtac10](#): > > For anyone that says the trench fighter plane isn’t op, here is a clip of me with it on xbox 1: [http://xboxclips.com/zdoxx8016/37a8a0bf-2768-49c2-8bc1-a0a7b83e43c9](http://xboxclips.com/zdoxx8016/37a8a0bf-2768-49c2-8bc1-a0a7b83e43c9) > > Note: I made the video, therefore I own it, using it for financial benefit will result in a copyright claim This show nothing. You should have been dead within 5 sec with a rear gunner in that attack plane. And the trench kill just show how infantry cant deal with planes. 4-5 players close together in the first place a pilot would look. ---
**Author:** ![gtac10](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/gtac10/32/102138_2.png) [@gtac10](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/gtac10)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 7:34am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/52 "2017-04-09T07:34:00Z")
> [@staRS-SirBob](#): > > > [@gtac10](#): > > > > For anyone that says the trench fighter plane isn’t op, here is a clip of me with it on xbox 1: [http://xboxclips.com/zdoxx8016/37a8a0bf-2768-49c2-8bc1-a0a7b83e43c9](http://xboxclips.com/zdoxx8016/37a8a0bf-2768-49c2-8bc1-a0a7b83e43c9) > > > > Note: I made the video, therefore I own it, using it for financial benefit will result in a copyright claim > > This show nothing. You should have been dead within 5 sec with a rear gunner in that attack plane. > And the trench kill just show how infantry cant deal with planes. 4-5 players close together in the first place a pilot would look. Actually, if you look closely, just before I got a multi-kill with the cluster bombs, there is an enemy aa gun in use. Also, later that round I disabled an enemy attack plane but then my gun overheated and the rear gunner killed me ---
**Author:** ![SirBobdk](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/sirbobdk/32/103491_2.png) [@SirBobdk](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/SirBobdk)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 7:38am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/53 "2017-04-09T07:38:00Z")
> [@gtac10](#): > > > [@staRS-SirBob](#): > > > > > [@gtac10](#): > > > > > > For anyone that says the trench fighter plane isn’t op, here is a clip of me with it on xbox 1: [http://xboxclips.com/zdoxx8016/37a8a0bf-2768-49c2-8bc1-a0a7b83e43c9](http://xboxclips.com/zdoxx8016/37a8a0bf-2768-49c2-8bc1-a0a7b83e43c9) > > > > > > Note: I made the video, therefore I own it, using it for financial benefit will result in a copyright claim > > > > This show nothing. You should have been dead within 5 sec with a rear gunner in that attack plane. > > And the trench kill just show how infantry cant deal with planes. 4-5 players close together in the first place a pilot would look. > > Actually, if you look closely, just before I got a multi-kill with the cluster bombs, there is an enemy aa gun in use. Also, later that round I disabled an enemy attack plane but then my gun overheated and the rear gunner killed me ok that clip i saw was just around 15 sec. If that AA gun was on E you should also have been dead if the gunner know hov to use it It says more about the players than the plane ---
**Author:** ![Maestro-FIN](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/maestro-fin/32/102718_2.png) [@Maestro-FIN](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/Maestro-FIN)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 7:42am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/54 "2017-04-09T07:42:00Z")
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**Author:** ![gtac10](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/gtac10/32/102138_2.png) [@gtac10](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/gtac10)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 7:45am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/55 "2017-04-09T07:45:00Z")
> [@staRS-SirBob](#): > > > [@gtac10](#): > > > > > [@staRS-SirBob](#): > > > > > > > [@gtac10](#): > > > > > > > > For anyone that says the trench fighter plane isn’t op, here is a clip of me with it on xbox 1: [http://xboxclips.com/zdoxx8016/37a8a0bf-2768-49c2-8bc1-a0a7b83e43c9](http://xboxclips.com/zdoxx8016/37a8a0bf-2768-49c2-8bc1-a0a7b83e43c9) > > > > > > > > Note: I made the video, therefore I own it, using it for financial benefit will result in a copyright claim > > > > > > This show nothing. You should have been dead within 5 sec with a rear gunner in that attack plane. > > > And the trench kill just show how infantry cant deal with planes. 4-5 players close together in the first place a pilot would look. > > > > Actually, if you look closely, just before I got a multi-kill with the cluster bombs, there is an enemy aa gun in use. Also, later that round I disabled an enemy attack plane but then my gun overheated and the rear gunner killed me > > ok that clip i saw was just around 15 sec. > If that AA gun was on E you should also have been dead if the gunner know hov to use it > It says more about the players than the plane True, but a fighter plane shouldn’t be able to take out 3 soldiers + 1 sentry with a single cluster-bomb run ---
**Author:** ![Trokey66](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/trokey66/32/103889_2.png) [@Trokey66](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/Trokey66)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 8:42am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/56 "2017-04-09T08:42:00Z")
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**Author:** ![Feed4u](https://battlefieldforum.co/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/f/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Feed4u](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/Feed4u)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 9:22am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/57 "2017-04-09T09:22:00Z")
```auto Comment hidden. ``` Hey he just started, that’s the point, at least he is making an effort to understand air mechanics before making further comments. At least give him credits, he started at 0.6 KPM and it’s improving. Rather than critiquing his current status with planes, unless most other plane haters he at least has a semblance of understanding. ---
**Author:** ![Trokey66](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/trokey66/32/103889_2.png) [@Trokey66](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/Trokey66)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 9:33am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/58 "2017-04-09T09:33:00Z")
> [@Feed4u](#): > > ```auto > Comment hidden. > > ``` ```auto Comment hidden. ``` Why thank you good Sir, I think 😉 Despite popular belief however, I am not a ‘plane hater’, just want a balanced game. ---
**Author:** ![SirBobdk](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/sirbobdk/32/103491_2.png) [@SirBobdk](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/SirBobdk)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 9:40am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/59 "2017-04-09T09:40:00Z")
@Trokey66 wrote > [@](#): > > If you think 1000% increase between my BF4 attempt and BF1 doesn’t indicate an issue, it demonstrates the you are completely biased and don’t want your crutches nerf’d. > Who would have guessed I would be top 7% in anything flying related!? First you can’t compare BF1 with BF4. If not for the MAA and active noob rader in BF4 it would have been just as easy to fly in BF4 as in BF1. Very few are flying or even know how to fly. Top 7% is only a matter of time spending in a plane. And you being in Top 7% just shows how few are flying and how few kills it takes. All players can get the same SPM and KDR in a tank. Why should it be so different in a plane and why should it be harder to fly than using a tank. People think its easier to counter a tank VS a plane and still tanks are on top 5 of the scoreboard on every map with high spm and kdr. Planes are not. ---
**Author:** ![StalHamarr](https://battlefieldforum.co/user_avatar/battlefieldforum.co/stalhamarr/32/103601_2.png) [@StalHamarr](https://battlefieldforum.co/u/StalHamarr)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2017, 9:52am UTC](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102/60 "2017-04-09T09:52:00Z")
Again with the BF4 ¯\_(ツ)\_/¯. We had this little thing called _helicopters_ on bf4. You can’t compare BF1 planes with BF4 planes. You have to compare _BF1 air with BF4 air_. Yes, you didn’t get farmed as much by planes on BF4, but you were farmed HARD by littlebirds, while jets were more focused on vehicles. At the same time, scout helicopters also had strong anti-air capabilities. Planes didn’t kill infantry as much, but threats from the air were the same, if not higher on BF4. [Previous page](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102.md?page=2) [Next page](https://battlefieldforum.co/t/its-time-to-nerf-planes/259102.md?page=4)