+1 agree with OP! I thought that the ammo restrictions (massive change just in itself!) was more than enough of a nerf from bf3 AH days!
But BF always gone down hill since BF2 days. How i miss the the maneuverability of those choppers. barrellrolls ect. chop vs chop fight were EPIC! Infact the jet dynamics were great too. None of this hit ceiling then just STOP… Anyway thats what happens I guess when you make one of the best games EVER made and then fire all the staff that made it, then proceed to make games for all these console/COD noobs who won’t take the time to learn how to take out air assets with skill based weapons!
Haven’t read the all thread, but i totally agree with OP.
The attack chopper is the weakest vehicle in game… that’s not normal.
It goes so slow a turtle can ran you over… on foot
Honestly guys, we don’t want an OP attack heli. Just give us something we can work with. Nothing more. Give a slight bump of some sort and see how it goes.
You guys need to watch Attack Heli video on youtube by levelcap and other players. They dominate with the A-chopper. I think you guys just suck at the chopper and want it EZ mode. I seen lots of video of A-Chopper with 30-40 kill in a round with about a handful of death only. If they get buffed more wouldn’t these guys be at 100-10?
LevelCap has a good video on how not to get shot down and play defensive in an A-chopper.
[youtube.com] he does say AA are strong but look how his gunner is 17-1 and he’s 2-1 but with multi vehicle destroyed. He’s even telling you that you need to play more defensive now. You can’t just go in and starting owning everyone like before. but you can still do good. That video isn’t in beta and their are more video and better pilot i seen. You just need to learn how to plan smart like how he does.
btw I know i suck with the Air Vehicle I blame myself not the game, unlike some people. I’m not asking them to make it easier for me to dominate, I need to learn how to play.
Do more than a 2sec research. You’re not a kid anymore you dont need to be spoon feed.
For what I am about to say…I am sorry. BUT YOU SIR ARE THE VERY REASON BATTLEFIELD ENDS UP SUCKING!!!
You clearly have no idea what you are talking about. Those vids are before the TV missile nerf. Plus the other vid is on Dawnbreaker. One of two maps that only the AH can survive at. Seriously dude??? I honestly don’t know what more to say to you. Utter ignorance.
I stand corrected on the videos but the only thing either of those videos accomplishes is adding examples of exactly what is being discussed in this thread…I counted at least 7 tv hits that got no hit markers at all. Did you not notice that the aa on the enemy team was doing nothing at all? And I hardly saw any stingers flying their way…
I fly in a similar fashion to levelcap but it doesn’t really matter if the aa has active radar and/or if the enemy team has 7 stingers on the map. You become totally useless if the enemy team has even a quarter of a brain. Which is not how it should be. It should take a good amount of teamwork AND skill to take out a good heli crew.
Not saying we need to go back to the days of double flares that basically make you invincible…but DICE has nerfed the heli so hard that it is almost completely useless now…just like the stealth jet
I’m sorry, but don’t start on this. You know there’s an issue when you see several things happening:
Low levels camping with spam-fire Stiglas, going 0/20 and yet still able to knock out and kill two people using a strong asset who are co-operating and skilled.
Very few people being able to effectively fly helicopters without being killed.
One man with his crutch Stigla effectively locking down open maps.
Scout helicopters having an advantage against attack helicopters regarding manoeuvrability, minigun damage and repair spam.
Infantry running towards a death-machine that has an advantage against them instead of fleeing for cover.
I’ve flown attack helicopters in several Battlefield titles to date, and can go well in them even in BF4. Go on, check some of my favourite battlereports. Things along the lines of 24/0. And because of some people occasionally going well, you say that it’s ‘perfectly fine?’ On most open maps it’s almost impossible to fly helicopters because of the extreme range and power of lock-on weapons. If even a few enemies get hard-ons whenever they see me flying around and decide that Conquest is actually Stare-The-Helicopter-To-Death there is almost no point bothering flying. When only the adept pilots can go very well on a stacked match or specific map, you know there’s a problem. You pulled a video of one of the better pilots, co-operating with a good gunner, most likely against incompetent enemies, and say ‘because this guy did well you guys all suck hurr durr.’ Give me a break. Currently, the most viable maps for flying are Shanghai and Dawnbreaker. Maps like Lancang see MAA camping in uncap and shooting cross-map and killing you. You can’t possibly tell me that’s balanced.
It’s bad enough many elements of helicopters are broken anyway, (ECM and Flares usually not doing what they’re supposed to do) but the abundance of this no-skill-spam is horrendous. In my opinion, OP has it perfectly right. Really, in a game like BF4 where they bring back the SRAW and give you the option of SMAWs which fire on a straight plain, if you even have some semblance of skill, why would you even bother using Stiglas?
The issue is the game catering to people who can’t play the game well. And, before someone cries “helicopter abuser, mad he can’t use his crutch vehicle to dominate,” that couldn’t be farther from the truth. I merely enjoy flying attack helicopters more than other vehicles, but frequently play as infantry and use other vehicles, and don’t wish for an ‘untouchable OP rape machine.’ When I play infantry in BF games and get steamrolled by a good attack heli team I couldn’t care less. That is when I whip out a self-guided rocket or RPG, not cry and throw a tantrum. Because teamwork such as this is supposed to be rewarded, so even if you can’t manage to take out the helicopter it seems rather immature to get all whiny about it solely because someone’s skill level is above your own. I cannot fathom why being destroyed by good teamwork angers people enough to cry out for nerfs to helicopters and buffs to crutch weapons like Stingers. It’s now almost as if DICE has pilots on a leash, snapping them back saying “No, bad pilot! Honing your skill so you can be better than most is unfair to people who don’t play often!” All because of people who are too bad/lazy to use more difficult but reliable measures to take out helicopters.
Really, even if only under radar came back, it would fix a lot of issues. It would force people who normally camp with their Stiglas, waiting for that hit of adrenaline as they stare more air vehicles to death, to instead be in the fight because sitting around won’t be enough to kill good pilots. It would also force people to instead use skill and/or teamwork to kill helicopters, because they would be often flying much lower. This, combined with an increased Stigla reload time or decreased effect of critical and mobility hits on air vehicles, would really be enough to set the playing field straight. Really, helos should be taken out by either a) skill, (guiding the SRAW into it or making a good RPG shot) or b) teamwork, (getting multiple people to fire Stiglas at helos at the correct time, not simply one man spamming them whenever possible). Catering to people who just can’t play well is hardly fair, and it completely renders practice and skill useless when you can be easily countered by someone who is terrible.
Now, I’m sure I’ve left some points out, so feel free to argue and whine about infantry who, in the Battlefield rock-paper-scissors style mechanics, are supposed to be inherently disadvantaged against helicopters, should be able to strong-arm any air vehicles without utilising any skill simply because they alone have the ‘right tools.’
I know my friend refuses to fly on anything but shanghai any other map and the AA is in spawn (untouchable unless the jet pilot has map awareness) or if the AA isn’t being a pain you get.. jet ramming (I cri evrytym)
such trauma
In my opinion..
Re-introducing below radar would help a lot. Like, it would force the AA to use its main gun (which is still very effective) when the helicopter gets too close whilst still hindering the helicopter when it goes for straif runs and if below radar worked how it did in BF3 after patch then the helicopter will still be very vulnerable to infantry. But.. at least the helicopter can avoid lock-ons when at a distance (from both the AA and air vehicles) dunno what you’d do with those passive radar rockets though :?
(inb4 infy + stingers sitting with the AA :P)
I know I’m focusing a lot on the AA, mainly because everything else has been said in OP but I think the problem is that they’re trying to make one vehicle counter all opposing teams air vehicles, because of this it’ is just so devastating to one individual vehicle and the Attack helicopters gets the worst of it
anywho, if dice thinks things are fine how they are.. r.i.p viper Q.Q
